James: 0:08

welcome back to the nerd nexus. Today we have a very special guest, a good friend of mine, taylor jackson. Uh, taylor, he is a school psychologist and a lifelong fan of superheroes, science fiction and fantasy. He is a devoted fan and admirer of the Dark Knight, which I hope to talk to you a lot about today, taylor, bring it on. And you're also a fellow Sander fan, big fan of Brandon Sanderson and his Cosmere, so that'll be a lot of fun to dive into a little bit as well. I know you had mentioned also that your love for all things nerdy began with Saturday morning cartoons like Batman, the animated series and the Justice League, as well as playing plenty of Batman video games. You get to join us today on the Nerd Nexus to jump in and talk about these fandoms and, in your own words, you say you love stories that defy the odds on a character-driven adventure, and I couldn't agree more. That's always really fun. So I'd like to talk to you, man, and nerd out.

Taylor: 1:14

Yeah, thanks for having me Fun.

James: 1:15

Thanks for joining my podcast here in my basement Having a good time.

Taylor: 1:20

Anytime, it's an excellent nerd Nexus basement, I might say.

James: 1:24

Yeah yeah, the Nexus feels more like a cave or like a hobbit hole right now, but it but you're talking to the batman fan like we literally dwell in caves. We do I just need a waterfall entrance into my basement.

Taylor: 1:38

We'll work on that we're set.

James: 1:39

But, um, yeah, anyway, uh, thanks for being here. Um, so, before we jump too far in, I was going to have you participate really quick. In our very first email that we got to the Nerd Nexus podcast at gmailcom, someone messaged us, so this actually just happened to be an old buddy of mine from way back in high school who caught the podcast and he brought up some fun stuff and had some questions for us.

James: 2:07

So in my episode, uh, that I met with my, my wife, and we talked uh we did talk a little bit about how bad the adaptation of the aragon series was in the movie yeah, uh, we didn't go into too much detail about it, but, but we talked about how it was pretty rough, um, and it got Mike Farnsworth uh, this friend of mine thinking about the cartoon Lord of the Rings movie. Um, and he's not talking about the new, like Peter Jackson anime one he's talking about, like the 1970s.

Taylor: 2:38

Lord of the Rings cartoon.

James: 2:39

Uh, did you ever watch that?

Taylor: 2:41

Probably when I was like 10 or younger. I saw clips of it, but not in like conscious memory to say anything smart about it.

James: 2:52

Yeah, I think I saw it my freshman year of high school. It was like one of those things where it was the end of the year and so the teachers were kind of like playing movies whatever, whatever and. I remember it was a math class and it was a old, old Lord of the Rings cartoon and I think it was the battle of the five armies or whatever. Oh yeah, and I just remember. Just one clip is all I remember, but it's like the dwarves talking. They're like now there's four armies. Now there's five armies.

Taylor: 3:18

Just like oh wow, there we go.

James: 3:21

But yeah, my thoughts on it. That was one of the questions. What were your thoughts on it? I think when you look back at any of the old stuff it feels a little cheesy. Yeah, for sure, and I'm sure years from now, people are going to look back at our stuff and be like that was a little cheesy.

Taylor: 3:39

Right.

James: 3:40

But is there anything that you recall from earlier times or older adaptations that you find a lot of cheese in, or something that you liked when you were younger? But you look back now and you're like that's not as good as I remember.

Taylor: 3:54

That's kind of cheesy. Oh, that's a tough question. I don't remember a lot specifically of it, but I do remember seeing a video online recently of someone who like resurrected the song from the end of return of the King and it was like the most beautiful song ever and they like duetted it and put it to an orchestra and everything. It's called like. The road goes ever on and like it's beautiful. So I think there's like even even in the some of the cheesy stuff, there's like still some nostalgia, but also some like redeemable gems. You know, like you wouldn't want to throw it all away, and I think I think like this is a perfect example, too, of like even the cheese sometimes keeps it alive for a longer time so that we can like, so that the franchise as a whole can can stick around for us and see better days in the future.

James: 4:42

Yeah, I don't know, sometimes it's fun to just go days in the future. Yeah, I don't know. Sometimes it's fun to just go back to the cheesy stuff. Anyways.

Taylor: 4:48

Oh, for sure.

James: 4:48

But you go back you're like oh, I remember this being so much cooler, but I still love it, but it is a little cheesier than I remember.

Taylor: 4:54

Yeah, the ones that come to my mind like I think I know going into them they're going to be cheesy. I don't remember the last, but I go back to some like VHS's from the 90s or something and like I remember one like called page master from when I was growing up and and like I knew it was going to be cheesy but it was like because I went in with that expectation and not like this is the greatest movie you've ever seen, like I think it was still pleasantly entertained well, I know we're going to dive into superheroes specifically, so I'm thinking like did you ever watch, like the old lou frigno, the incredible hulk?

James: 5:27

I didn't watch a lot of hulk but I'm like familiar with it, yeah and and instead of cgi, it was just this big dude who painted himself green, and he was just buff, right I fist bumped him at comic-con one time.

Taylor: 5:38

It was nice and you survived. My hand recovered after a few days.

James: 5:41

Well, that's kind of cool, um, but I was thinking of that one and then I actually never watched it.

James: 5:46

But I have seen little clips that just make me laugh of like an old captain america one actually oh, yeah, and it'll show me pulls out his shield like there's a robber running away, and then it has a clip of him throwing it, and then it cuts to like the, the little frisbee looking thing that looks like it's hanging from a string, and then it like softly hits the guy in the back of the head and he jumps forward like I don't know, it was pretty cheesy but it made me laugh. But uh, yeah, um, I don't know, I think there's, there's a lot of old stuff that's uh fun to dive back into. But then when you do, you're like I remember this being cooler.

Taylor: 6:19

The other one I was thinking of was captain planet oh, that was never big in the Captain Planet, but I do still hold it in some high esteem.

James: 6:28

Yeah, I just remember it was always really funny when Captain Planet was getting ready to come and they all start calling him out and they hold up their little power rings. They're like Earth, fire, wind, and then you get this one person, heart Right.

Taylor: 6:40

We ran out of elements, yeah, Element of love. But it's funny, though, to think about, like how certain cheesy things like are admired looking back and other ones are like cringeworthy looking back, because, like when you were mentioning superheroes, like I thought you were going to mention, like Batman 66, you know, with Adam West and everything, oh yeah yeah, but that one's like, beloved Like, even though it's so cheesy it's like you know, almost want to hide behind your hands while you're watching a little bit, sometimes like it's like no one can say a bad thing about batman 66 and now that I said that someone will.

James: 7:11

But yeah, it's been, uh, such a long time too, but that that's the one right where they would like kick, and it would pause and go kapow or whatever, yeah, yeah oh man, that, yeah, that's. That's funny. That was a good. I can't believe I didn't even think of that one. Then that's hilarious.

Taylor: 7:25

And it's one of those that like makes you question. You're like do they know it's this cheat? Are they trying to be funny or is it just that bad that it's funny?

James: 7:36

I feel like that happens a lot, with not just cheesy though where you remember something being a certain way. Years later you're super excited to share it, and then you pull it back up and maybe you've outgrown it or something and then you're like almost cringing that you're showing it to someone.

Taylor: 7:48

Right.

James: 7:49

I specifically remember. Actually this is a funny one, but did you ever see the movie the Other Guys? That's Mark Wahlberg and Will Ferrell.

Taylor: 7:57

Yeah, yeah.

James: 7:59

I just remember it being really, really funny. And then it came on TV once and my dad was looking through the channels. I was like, oh, the other guys we should watch that. So like it was around lunchtime, they kept it on. We started watching it and I forgot about some of the inappropriate parts in it. Sitting there with my parents watching it and they'd crack a joke, that was maybe a little little on the vulgar side, spicy side and I was like I can't believe that I even recommended this.

James: 8:22

I don't remember any of that. I remember the funny scenes that weren't offensive and sure enough, there were things in there.

Taylor: 8:28

That's totally funny because I feel like, at least in my experience, that's what my parents would always do. It's like, oh, we loved this one growing up. It's from the 80s. Watch it and we get like five minutes in and there's like tons of nudity and swearing and we're like 12 years old and they're like oh, this is not what I remember.

James: 8:45

Mom, dad, what do you want us to watch?

Taylor: 8:47

but I I haven't exposed my parents to anything. I think to agree just yet, so I'll get there, though I'll get on your level all right.

James: 8:54

Well, um, we're gonna talk plenty more about, uh, superheroes. I think that'll be a fun one to dive into a little bit. But I wanted to discuss one thing that I actually didn't even mention in our intro to you. But you are an avid board gamer.

Taylor: 9:08

I am.

James: 9:09

You love board games and my wife and I do as well. I know we have had many couples night where we play some board games. But when we say board games I feel like the average person thinks board games. They think Monopoly, sorry, trouble, I don't know One of those just very simple games which I think there's still merit to. They're fun. That's why people play them. But when I think of people that are way into board games, I don't think of those games.

James: 9:38

They're usually obscure games. I feel like every time we sit down to play a game, you're like we got a new game and there's like a 95% chance. I've never heard of it. Even though I play a lot of weird games. It's like when we're excited to show each other, it's cause we found a little weird secret game, um and so, uh, what do modern board games mean beyond the classics like monopoly and, sorry, like, how would you define like a modern board game?

Taylor: 10:07

like how would you define like?

James: 10:07

a modern board game, that's, that's a. That's a deep question. Yeah, because I mean what I'm trying to, I guess, explain is to the casual board gamer. They don't know what I'm talking about.

Taylor: 10:13

But I'm trying to say what does it mean, like when?

James: 10:15

I'm saying there's a unique game. What is that? Even, what is makes it unique?

Taylor: 10:18

I, I've kind of in my mind, as I've pondered this, like I think the I, I divide it into like three tiers, like I think there's your like tier one, like very simple, like the sorry, the monopoly, the catchphrase, you know Scrabble and I don't want this conversation to be like dissing on those because we wouldn't be here without those right. Like they set up what games are and I think they're still great for lots of audiences. Like you're not going to play. You know Deep Rock Galactic with your grandma, but you're going to play.

Taylor: 10:48

Scrabble with your grandma right. And then there's like I would call it, the middle tier, which is like Ticket to Ride or Villainous or you know. It's like a little more complex. Not everyone's played it or heard of it before. Catan might even fall into that category right.

Taylor: 11:06

Those are becoming, I think, more mainstream. Those that are maybe I don't want to put an age on it, but coming up with, grew up with board games and now finding new ones. And then I think there's the more niche. You've never heard of this, or it cost over $100.

James: 11:21

Oh yeah, deep Rock, galactic Right.

Taylor: 11:23

Or it takes like two plus hours to play one session or something like that, you know, yeah, so I think, mechanically, you know, that's kind of what I think of with modern games is there's still a lot of, I think, new, simple games. You know there's card games that take 10, 15 minutes, but they're new and interesting, right, but I think there's just so much variety. But they're new and interesting, right, but I think there's just so much variety. It's almost like this genre has just caught up to things like movies and video games, where it's just like there's so much variety, you know, and there's people who get deep into it and there's people who are just here to have a good 10-minute experience.

James: 11:56

Yeah well, and I guess I'm going to jump back to a little bit about what this whole show is about about nerdy being the new cool. I feel shows about about nerdy being the new cool. I feel like that has helped propel this forward too. I mean, I feel like when I was a kid, being way into board games and trying to be like let's try this new thing, would be kind of oh, that guy's weird yeah, why doesn't he play monopoly? Come on, man, or why isn't he out playing sports or something?

James: 12:18

right and uh. Nowadays, though, so many people have these hobbies and it's celebrated, and I think that is really helping in all aspects. I mean, we talk about comic books. They're now like mainstream movies about comic books. Everybody knows about comic book characters, at least now.

James: 12:34

Now, it's not a matter of you have people that know comics and people who don't. Now it's people who know the true comics, people who know the movies and then people who maybe don't watch any of it. Like it, there's, there's more audience being reached, but, um, I was gonna ask you what you would say. Uh is one of your favorite board games, and I feel like that is a hard question because you have a lot, what would? You say is your favorite board game to play nowadays?

Taylor: 12:58

nowadays is easy to answer because I have. I have my favorite board game of all time, at least until another one comes around. But there's an indie board game my wife and I are playing called the Kinfire Chronicles, and it falls into that category of it cost about $120.

James: 13:14

Is that the one Did we play that once? We did do it around that one was fun yeah.

Taylor: 13:18

But for me it's perfect and I think it's a great example of just what what board games offer.

Taylor: 13:22

it's like an art form now right like there's depth, and even in that middle tier you have a depth of strategy that just isn't possible in like sorry, yeah, um, but I think now also with some of these higher end board games, you have a depth of art and a depth of story. One of the things I love about kinfire is it kind of holds your hand and it's like having dnd without a dm. Like you get there are consequences to every choice that you make. Your character progresses as you go along, right, but but someone doesn't have to like build the game on the backend. The game does the game Right. So so, anyways, so I love it. It's very simple to get into. It's set in like a fantasy world that like is very flushed out and beautiful and unique. So that's one of our favorite ones right now. Has like 21 scenarios you can play through. Each one takes like an hour, that's awesome.

James: 14:09

It's really cool, well, and I mean, you mentioned this a few times, just for anyone who doesn't know what we're talking about. So we talked about Deep Rock Galactic.

Taylor: 14:18

That's true.

James: 14:19

And that is based on a video game. They did a kickstarter the company that developed the game and they built a board game and it did cost a couple hundred dollars. But it has a bunch of little minifigs, uh little figurines, in there that you could paint if you wanted to, and they're really cool looking and I'd say the coolest minifigs I've seen in a game thus far.

Taylor: 14:40

They're pretty dope.

James: 14:41

They're pretty cool, but uh, I the ones. From what did you say? Chronicles of Kinfire.

Taylor: 14:47

Kinfire Chronicles. Yeah, Kinfire Chronicles.

James: 14:49

The ones in there aren't exactly like the little plastic figures. They're like really shiny, cool looking.

Taylor: 14:57

Yeah, they're standees, but they're acrylic. Yeah, they look really good they're kind of see-through, but they're very colorful and artsy. I love them.

James: 15:04

Well, so I guess the next question we both just talked about games that cost a couple hundred dollars. So if there was someone or something that's not as intimidating but still new, I mean I, I guess I have a couple thoughts in my head. I don't know, I don't know for sure if they're even considered that, like I'm, I'm thinking of, uh, remember, secret hitler oh yeah show me that one, that one wasn't too crazy. And there's no yeah video you could play with it.

James: 15:46

That like walks you throughout a play um and that one was kind of fun, but uh I mean, are there any that come to mind for you where you're like, okay, if I'm gonna take someone and indoctrinate them?

Taylor: 15:56

in the way of these cool board. Take them and just to maybe that middle tier even like I think. I think some of the ones that come to mind mind might be a little niche, but they're the ones on my mind right now are. There's one called the adventures of Robin Hood and it's really cool. It's a cooperative game. That's a big thing. Me and my wife, like we, we didn't love how we felt after. Like strategic games, like his, one person was always mad at the other person, right he's like can't believe you did that right, and so, anyways, we started to just drift away from those and just play solely cooperative games starting to think.

James: 16:27

That's why you invite me and my wife over, so that you can get mad at me instead no comment, um, but anyways, adventures of robin hood is really fun.

Taylor: 16:36

The cool thing about that one is it comes with a like a novel. It's like a leather bound like book, but each move that you make or spot on the board has a page number attached to it and it's like if you're in chapter seven and you landed here, like make your decision and come here. But it's very simple and straightforward, but it has like 10 chapters and a story that, like your consequences matter and stuff, but it's very easy to get into. Um. And then the other one a neighbor of ours introduced us just called bullet oh yeah and bullets a really fun one, just because it's a different experience.

Taylor: 17:05

It's almost like a live Tetris, almost you know, but with a few interesting mechanics, so that one's another fun one. There's Bullet Hearts and Bullet Star are kind of the base games.

James: 17:16

I was just that reminded me of one that you showed me that is very stress-inducing.

Taylor: 17:21

I have anxiety every time I play kites oh, kites, that's a good one. That's a great like entry level, though anybody can play kites you can explain it in 30 seconds or less and those are.

James: 17:30

Those are good too to get a fun game that's new, no one's heard of, and you don't have to say, okay, here's this 45 page manual we have to read to learn how to play instead it's like here I can explain it to you really quick and we can play a couple rounds and go yeah, kites. Uh, if you think it's bad enough having one timer and you're stressing out over it, there's what? Seven timers?

James: 17:48

going at the same time and oh man, yeah, that was a stressful one for sure. Um well, great. Uh, maybe I'll put some links to some of these games, yeah, so that people that want to take a look at them can take a look at them. And, uh, if the makers of these games here, hey, pass to advertise your games.

Taylor: 18:10

There you go Just kidding.

James: 18:12

These won't be affiliate links because I don't have affiliate links for them.

Taylor: 18:15

I don't know, so we'll just put it, we did not plan these games ahead of time, we did not plan this ahead of time Disclaimer, um, okay.

James: 18:22

Well, a second thing that I wanted to talk into and uh, talk about and show you a little bit uh as well, cause I've got this box behind me. It's mysterious. I wanted to share with you. But uh, reading and and books, um, I do think that's kind of a common theme in the nerd nexus, because everybody reads at least a little bit. And, uh, when I think of the nerdy side, we tend to dive into fantasy and sci-fi. But, um, I think it's fun to talk about the books we read and the worlds and the character building, and it doesn't have to be fantasy or sci-fi to have characters and a world so um, but uh, I know, the one thing we have in common, uh for sure, though, is brandon sanderson.

James: 19:04

Yeah, and I feel like, even though we've both read brandon sanderson, I feel like we also kind of took different routes in there. We've kind of read some different things. Yeah, um, but uh, what's your experience with brandon sanderson? How did you get into the cosmere?

Taylor: 19:18

I think it's actually you, was it really partially? I like I think there were lots of people two, three to four years ago that were like talking about him a lot and reading him a lot and I just hadn't got into it yet. And so I think I finally I don't know if I started with Mistborn or the Way of Kings I kind of like did both simultaneously as it went on. But I think I just heard about him from like even our friend Tyler. We're always talking about him and my wife's brothers were always reading him. So I think it was just kind of like well, I'll give this a shot, because you guys keep asking me if I've read this book and I haven't read this book. So I kind of have like my in my brain. I'm like, hey, if somebody's asked me more than three times, I better put it on my priority list, right? So it was kind of one of those things and so glad I did.

Taylor: 20:04

So I've kind of purged. I tried to like stay in the cause mirror as much as I could and catch up to things like lost metal came out like a year or two into like my stuff. Well, I've got to catch up on this more. And now, like you know, wind and truth just came out. So I was.

James: 20:17

I've been caught up in that one for a little bit, but the funny thing is I have not read the lost metal or wind and truth. That's funny. It's like the two people who introduced me. I'm like have you read this yet?

Taylor: 20:26

and they're're like no, I'm like oh, you guys got me started.

James: 20:30

Well, one of the things that I was going to ask you a little bit about is and I'm not trying to embarrass you if it heads that direction- but I don't think it will, but I mean, what would to dive into reading these different books is one of my things that I just can't get over is when someone recommends a book, you hear it several times, you start seeing it on social media, everyone's talking about how great a book is, and then you try to read it and you just can't.

Taylor: 21:04

Right.

James: 21:05

This is not working for me. I can't get into it, or the writing's too complicated or this world building's too much. So I was going to ask, kind of where you think your reading level is and how you overcome any of those hurdles. If you come across those, maybe you don't.

Taylor: 21:21

Well, this is kind of a weird thing because when I think about that, I feel like I have the opposite problem almost where, like I've been spoiled by a few good authors and so now when I go into like some probably okay, but not like excellent authors, I'm like, ah, you know, like I don't know. Yeah, so like the an easy example, and sorry to any fans out there, there's nothing wrong with the stories.

Taylor: 21:46

Just like before I was into sanderson I was doing a lot of like orson scott card and things like doing like the enders quartet and the bean series and stuff and and he's a fantastic writer and he's so like cognitive and cerebral in his writing.

Taylor: 21:59

You just know exactly what's going on in somebody's head. And then I think I went from like a lot of orson scott cards, like the hunger games and which is which is at. You know, I've targeted at a younger audience, right, but it's just kind of a weird example for me of like it's so basic and I think we've talked a little bit about like I love Star Wars, a big Star Wars fan and I like the ideas in a lot of their books, but just like the way that they're written, it's just like I have a hard time getting into it and I think it's just because I've been spoiled with like once you go to some big authors that are so beautiful in their prose, like Sanderson or Orson Scott Card or you know some of these other ones, I'm like it's hard to go back to a simpler not simpler as in complicated, but like I don't know, not as I don't know high level writing form level writing form.

James: 22:51

I don't know I'm not finding the right words, but yeah, well, and I don't know if, uh, maybe maybe it just makes us book snobs, I wonder.

Taylor: 22:55

Yeah, I think I'm a little bit of a book. Stop now like there.

James: 22:57

There's a book series that, uh, I have heard lots of good things about and I finally read it, and I did read the entire trilogy.

James: 23:04

I think I've mentioned this to you before, but the, the poppy wars oh yeah um, so it's a series of three books, uh, it's uh, basically I think it's like japanese themed, kind of like a feudal japan kind of vibe to it and uh, the the book started off pretty good for me and then I just the more I got to know the main character, the more I just disliked the main character and I still thought the story was really good and I I that's what kept me going Like the book wasn't unentertaining, it wasn't like I, I didn't like it but I just could not. It was like reading through the mind of someone. That just annoyed me.

James: 23:41

So, uh it. I just felt like the the protagonist was very flip-floppy. It was one of those people that would be like I need to win at all costs, even if it, you know, cost the lives of my friends. And then, two seconds later, after she makes a decision that hurts her friends, she's like oh no, my friends are hurt. How could they ever be hurt? What will I do? And I'm like just two seconds ago you were just talking about you're gonna walk over the top right.

Taylor: 24:04

How did this happen?

James: 24:05

oh wait, it was me I just felt that was the vibe I got from the protagonist of that series. I felt like it was one second she was caring about her friends and that was the most important thing she could ever do is protect them. And then the next second it's all that mattered was winning. And then it was like she was shocked that her friends were hurt and I didn't feel like it lined up very well, and maybe I'm the only reader that felt that, because everyone else says they love it.

Taylor: 24:28

Yeah, I did think of one other example of uh, one I just had a hard time getting into and it wasn't on like the lower, you know levels, you know sort of thing and it's maybe a hot, hot, divisive opinion. But uh, wheel of time, I'm currently reading through and I think I'm gonna finish the fourth book and so I'm not like that far into it, but it kind of feels like homework for me. It's like I want to get through it because, like, people say good things, um, but like hard time really buying into the characters and it's well done world building, but there's something about the way he world builds and stuff that I just like it's harder for me to like care about and so I'm still gonna give it a go. And actually this last book, shadow rising, that I just finished, there were some plot lines and I'm like, oh, I actually care about what's happening right now, and so I got a little more invested.

Taylor: 25:17

So I'm still going to give it a go. But that one, you know it's not bad, but like 3.5 or 4 stars versus like some of the 5-star books or whatever you know.

James: 25:26

Yeah, yeah, I was going to ask. When it comes to Brandon Sanderson, have you read a lot of his non-Cosmere work?

Taylor: 25:32

I've started to dabble, like I've done Arithmetist, I've done Legion, I thought Legion was a very unique take. Yeah, it was a lot of fun, and that was one he kept recommending to me. I have started Skyward. I don't know if I've done other ones yet, but those are some of the ones that I've done so far have you read snapshot? No, but I hear they're adapting it for tv right, are they?

James: 25:57

I think so that'll be interesting, that and skyward it's a novella, like it's a short short story, but, um, that one kind of blew my mind and the funny thing is, uh, sometimes I feel like I'm a snob and I I'm not giving enough attention to other things. And then sometimes I feel like I'm a snob and I'm not giving enough attention to other things, and then sometimes I feel like I'm illiterate and like I'm like this was a masterpiece. I go tell someone else like really, so like Snapshot I'm not saying it, you know, expect it to be like super simple minded, but I just remember thinking there was some cool twist in that. Yeah, it kind of blew my mind. I thought it was a really cool idea.

James: 26:27

And then when I went, the one person I talked to about it was like, really, I Saw it coming a mile away, like to me it was just it's pretty expected, and I was like, oh, but yeah, snapshot is really cool. It's the idea of like they have this technology where you can literally like Go into a time period, like they'll put you into the time period that a crime happened and you'll witness the crime. So they, they have like detectives that go into a crime scene, watch it happen and come back to testify against the criminal.

James: 26:56

So like, okay, we know that the murder happened between this time and this time and we think it was this person, and so these detectives go into the time period and just kind of like make sure they see it happen and then they can come back and testify as witnesses, and testify as witnesses. And so the story is about these two people that are trying to track down this killer and see what happened.

Taylor: 27:16

Yeah.

James: 27:17

And I just thought it was really cool.

Taylor: 27:20

That's awesome yeah.

James: 27:21

It was a unique story, for sure. But before we jump on because I know we want to talk a lot of superheroes, because I think that'll be fun but I wanted to show you what's in my box yeah, the box. So almost a year ago, I feel like there was a Kickstarter campaign that Brandon Sanderson did for his next Leatherbound.

Taylor: 27:40

Oh.

James: 27:40

And I got it just yesterday, beautiful, and I want to show you.

Taylor: 27:44

I say beautiful, but I haven't seen it yet.

James: 27:45

Actually yesterday, it might have been two days ago, but I got three books, so I'm going to show you really quick. Goodness right, this is words of radiance, volume one and volume two.

James: 28:01

oh man, so when they, when they put it in the, the leather bound, uh, the book's too big to just have one, so it's being two volume, but they're like gorgeous books and have some pretty artwork in there and uh, I feel the same way when I'm trying to open it, like so nervous to like I don't want to ruin it, but how do I do this carefully?

Taylor: 28:16

Right, it's beautiful, the ancient old Sabbath. That's been spoken.

James: 28:22

Yes, it's got like the gold foiled edges. Oh my goodness, it's got all sorts of artwork.

Taylor: 28:26

Even got like painted oh my goodness, yeah, artwork. Even got like painted thought oh my goodness, yeah. These illustrations are oh to die for those are beautiful.

James: 28:34

So I'm like do I just like keep them on my shelf to look pretty or do I just start reading from them?

Taylor: 28:38

and because I don't think right, I'm not like buying them to sell them, right no, they're definitely like a collector's thing and I didn't realize they were so beautiful on the inside. That makes me want them all the more right sorry, sorry uh to your wife it's all good but big cost.

James: 28:55

But those are beautiful have you heard of sanderson curiosities kind of a new thing he's doing no I haven't. So that was the second part of this box I was going to show you he has these uh books that he releases that are like, I mean, some people might. You'll have to tell me your thoughts on Brandon Sanderson. Some people might say that this is his way of doing, like a money grab, and maybe that's partially true. I mean, this is his income, this is his business his job?

James: 29:21

Yeah, but he is. I do find Brandon Sanderson very passionate about what he does, and he started going back to some of his old works that were never published, that weren't good enough to be published, yeah, and he's starting to put them into these Sanderson curiosities. Okay, and so it's basically. I have one on the shelf that was from an earlier Kickstarter.

Taylor: 29:41

That's the way of King's prime.

James: 29:43

Yes, so it's like back before it's it's the same story but it's not the same story. So it's like his early idea of what the Stormlight Archives would be. Some of the character names are different.

Taylor: 29:54

Some of the plot is slightly different. Some characters don't even exist. Yeah Right.

James: 29:56

And so it's kind of interesting to read what the world was going to be. But then you have Dragonsteel Prime, his first book, right, which I guess was like his first book, and he mentions because I I was reading a little bit of just what, what is this?

Taylor: 30:13

because I wasn't even entirely sure I just knew I wanted it, so I got it without quite knowing right um, but he talks about um that a lot of this book is.

James: 30:22

You'll see the ideas of other books, like things in this book made it to other books so it's like he had a lot of good stuff in here that just didn't mesh and then he took those ideas and put them in other stories Like the shattered planes apparently came from this. Oh, it's just a Shalon from the way of Kings. Apparently, that character was originally like. She originated from this book.

Taylor: 30:41

That's cool.

James: 30:42

Um and uh. Anyway, he just talks about how there's a lot of elements that would become Cosmere canon in other books. That kind of originated with this idea, and so I don't even know what the story is fully about, but I'm excited to read it.

Taylor: 30:58

Yeah.

James: 31:00

It's not as fancy as the.

Taylor: 31:01

Oh, for sure yeah.

James: 31:03

But I know this is not a video podcast, so I'm going to put pictures of this for people to see what I'm talking about.

Taylor: 31:16

But I wanted to share that with you because I think it's fun. No, that's really cool, and I think you know you mentioned the money grab thing. Uh, think, to anyone listening, you can read the ebook or listen to the audiobook for free on his website on dragon steel. So, like, I think, with this m way of king's prime, like there, you're paying for the you know the nice bookshelf edition, right. But but like, if you're just curious, sanderson curiosities, right, like you can just kind of go and tinker around and see what it is too right. So so I do think you know it's an easy way to make some money. But I also just think, like he's got people that are so invested into his worlds.

James: 31:49

We just want to be in his world at all times, right yeah, that's the thing it's like if if you think he's a money grabber, it's because people want to spend money on it like if no one spent money on it, there would be no, um, there would be no fancy leather bounds, I guess. Last question before we jump into our comic book stuff, because I got excited for the superheroes, but um, I was gonna ask what your who.

Taylor: 32:10

Your favorite character in the cosmere is oh boy, that's a deep question and I don't know if I've ever thought about it before. Yeah, we will go with a simple answer.

Taylor: 32:21

I don't know if it's like my all-time favorite anything, but I do love lift lift okay lift is always a good time and I think for some people the character doesn't work and she's annoying. But you just get these one-liners that are so great and I love the idea of literally the world is falling apart and she's cracking jokes. She's just sliding around complaining about pancakes and everybody's like. The desolation is here.

James: 32:51

Humanity is doomed. She's like pancake, right exactly so.

Taylor: 32:54

So I think she's always a lot of fun, and anytime she comes up I'm like, oh, here she is right. Like, so I say, that's one.

James: 33:00

I also love I got. I got a kick out of when she she made a shard fork yes, I think yeah, she sure did so, wait, you could do anything oh yeah, sorry, I don't know if that's a major spoiler. It's like four years. It's like people have these shard blades or shard spears or whatever, and she's like can I make a shard fork? I guess. All right, sorry, I interrupted you no, no, you're good.

Taylor: 33:23

Yeah, the other one, I don't know if he counts because he's like everywhere, but I do love Hoyt. You know, or wit, every time we see, see Hoyt and it's, you know, kind of the fun. Where's Waldo? In some of the books and and the other ones he's more of a prominent character, but just the idea of like he's the best, like bard type, you know, you've ever created for those of the D and D fame.

James: 33:42

Yeah, yeah, I actually like a lot of the characters in the wax and Wayne series. Oh yeah of the characters in the wax and wayne series. Oh yeah, they. They surprised me a little bit too, because I mean the series is great, but if you're into the cosmere, the big thing is the stormlight archives. Everyone talks about the original miss born trilogy a lot, but I really like um wayne and it's been a minute since I read it. Uh, not starris, the other girl marasi, mercy, mercy.

James: 34:08

It did start with an m so yeah, it'd been a minute since I'd read that and, uh, you did remind me, though wax is actually one of my more serious favorite characters.

Taylor: 34:17

For me he's like a cosmere batman, um, that like he obviously has superpowers in this, but like just the vibe of like the, the cityscape and like flying through the city, and he's kind of like dark and brooding a little bit, not to crack jokes or whatever, but he's a detective Right. So for me I've always like we'll get into Batman, but I've like always seen myself in Batman a little bit and so for having like a Mistborn Batman, like it felt really, really cool to me and just I and just I had a hard time getting into vin. I don't have any problems with vin from era one, but then like but wax, I like immediately glued into and felt myself as wax, like I couldn't quite with vin so yeah so he's probably my more serious top, top choice oh, and I I you know.

James: 35:04

I specifically mentioned wayne and merisi is that how you say it? Yeah, I didn't listen to the audio. I actually read those ones but. But I like wax and Steris as well so I just thought Steris is interesting. At the beginning I was like man. I hate her right. She's obnoxious and then you learn to really like her. But speaking of Batman, batman.

Taylor: 35:29

Batman. Let's dive into Batman. Nuff said.

James: 35:31

Nuff said and that is our podcast, so one of the things that I thought would be really interesting to get your take on. So I guess first you used to have a Batman-specific podcast.

James: 35:44

I did Tell me a little bit about that. What exactly did you talk about on your podcast? What inspired you to do the podcast? I know it was a little while ago, but just give me the lowdown on your podcast and your experience with Batman and podcasting at my university at the IT help desk People would call in, they forgot their passwords or whatever and we'd help them out.

Taylor: 36:13

And one of my buddies said Batman v Superman was about to come out and he's like you're a Batman fan. And I'm like I'm a Batman fan. He's like are you so excited?

James: 36:22

I'm like, I'm so excited.

Taylor: 36:24

And then he was just like I'm thinking of starting a podcast, do you want to co-host with me? And I'm like sure, man. And so it's. That's it just kind of like came out naturally like that. We just started nerding out about batman and so, uh, yeah, we did have a podcast. It was called beyond the bat cave, the. I think it was called the batman centric dc comics or dc universe podcast, something like that. So so it was a lot of fun. I think we did somewhere around 50 or so episodes. So it was a good. It was a lot of fun. I think we did somewhere around 50 or so episodes.

Taylor: 36:50

So it was a good run for a couple of years and so it was a lot of fun. We kind of would review some movies or watch some old episodes of things or talk about the news and who they cast for Batman, and so it was a lot of fun. Yeah, I'll cherish that time.

James: 37:06

This brings me back a little bit, yeah yeah, well, I am a little bit, yeah, yeah, um, well, I, I am a Batman fan too. Um, I would say for me, I'm relatively I mean, it would be the last couple of years a new Batman fan. Yeah, um, and so, uh, I mean, there's so many ways to get into superheroes now. So you could be approaching them from hey superheroes now, so you could be approaching them from hey, I saw the Marvel movies. Hey, I saw the DC movies.

Taylor: 37:36

Hey, I picked up a comic book hey, I was at Comic-Con and some guy was dressed as a bat.

James: 37:38

I don't know you could find your way into that, like the Big Bang Theory.

James: 37:41

I don't know if you ever watched that TV series but these four really nerdy guys, they're always talking about comic books and it was entertaining, um and so for, uh, for me, I, I had an uncle, um, darren Smith shout out to Darren if you're listening but uh, way into comic books. And my brother, uh, he was way into comic books and then I was kind of just happy to be along for the ride. I enjoyed them, but I was not nearly as deep into it as they were. I enjoyed them, but I was not nearly as deep into it as they were. And they both were big Marvel fans and so I was a Marvel fan.

James: 38:15

Yeah, and my favorite superheroes on the Marvel side are Captain America and Iceman. Those are my two favorites, but I always just thought Marvel's the way it goes. And whenever people would ask like Marvel or DC, I'm like oh, Marvel's so much better. I just always, I was basically rooting for Marvel without knowing what DC had to offer. Right, and then I started watching some of the DC animated cartoons yeah, and they've got good stuff.

James: 38:51

The animated like stuff that DC puts out is way, way better than anything Marvel, I think, has put out right. They don't mess around.

James: 38:54

As far as the animated stuff goes, if you look at the live action, I think dc's got you know some good stuff, but they couldn't quite form the universe and I feel like they kept trying to and they in my opinion it's like they took too long to get it together, that actors were exiting as they were trying to bring them together, like christian bale, like if they could have brought that batman into the universe with superman, like. But christian bale was done and they brought in a new batman and then, uh, I don't know, I just feel like it was kind of falling apart as they were trying to put it together. That that's my opinion, and so some of these movies are really great standalone, but then when you're trying to look at it as a universe, I Worked great.

Taylor: 39:32

Yeah, I never quite took off, like, and then I think sometimes they some people say they actually went too fast, you know trying to make an Avengers in there like third film or whatever right, so so yeah, like that we didn't quite get the universe and I think with the new Superman movie coming out they're trying to reboot that. I don't know if they're trying to make an Avengers, but just like a new, new universe a little bit. So I think it'll be interesting to see what comes about. But I definitely agree with your overall sentiment.

Taylor: 39:58

I think DC movies have some, some classics right, like you know, look at Christopher E, superman, the Dark Knight trilogy like like, not just for superhero fans, but like universally beloved films, you know, like. So I think those are good, whereas before the MCU right, like like we didn't we didn't have any Marvel beloved. I guess we had the Tobey Maguire, spider-mans right, like that was kind of it.

James: 40:21

You look at some of the the Marvel movies before they got the MCU together and there were some, some that weren't as great. Right, daredevil, I don't know. Yeah, electra.

Taylor: 40:31

Yeah, all those things those were. Even the Hulks were a little questionable. It took three times to get the right Hulk. Yeah, yeah.

James: 40:37

But yeah. So I guess the question is then for you DC or Marvel?

Taylor: 40:43

Oh, that's hard. Which one do I like or which one I think is better?

James: 40:49

I don't know. I didn't really put any context there, I was just going to say which are you pro DC over Marvel or pro Marvel over DC? I mean, I'm pro-DC over Marvel, or?

Taylor: 40:56

pro-Marvel over DC. I mean, I'm pro-superheroes, right, like I like all of them. I think I kind of had I don't know if I had the opposite experience of you, but like I always had Batman, you know, and then so therefore I always had Superman, I always had the Justice League, and so like that was where my bias was growing up. And then, like the Dark Knight trilogy came out when I was like in junior high and high school and so like I cemented it as like the greatest thing to ever exist, right, and so I think obviously I have to pick Batman's my man. So I'm going with DC. I do think they have.

Taylor: 41:29

It's just a very different vibe, like if you think about like the macro of those two universes Like DC, about like the macro of those two universes, like like dc is about like I don't know, their forerunners are like gods among men. You know, like besides batman a little bit, you got wonder woman and superman and the flash, like really these they kind of bring back some of these like greek and roman god myths, right, and and try to um, and those are their forerunners, and so it's kind of just interesting to see like how that interacts with the world. But anyways, I'm rambling. He caught me rambling.

James: 42:01

No, no, that's perfect. I was going to ask you. You know, let's dive into some of the maybe popular or unpopular opinions about Batman. So one thing I often hear is that Batman is basically superhero due to plot, armor, plot armor.

Taylor: 42:18

I hear that all the time. I'm less familiar with the term.

James: 42:21

But basically, like the only reason Batman can like the saying is does Batman have prep time, like they say? If Batman has prep time he can beat anybody, and you were just saying it's like God's man among men, except for Batman, like. So, batman, he could take up the whole justice league if he had prep time Right. And you know, there's part of me I love Batman, and the more I've read the comics and dove into some of the series, the more I kind of understand the reason behind that and I'm like yeah.

James: 42:49

Batman is really skilled and a really unique character as you learn why he's so good at all of that. But at the same time it's like, okay, truly, you've got someone with super speed that could probably just snap his neck and end him right. Is batman legitimately just being protected by plot armor or, uh, do you think that he can really defend himself against superheroes and supernatural beings like what? What is what's your take on on batman? Is he as invincible as I think a lot of people make him seen or the comics make him seem?

Taylor: 43:23

I would that last question? I would say no, right, and that's part of what makes him, I think, more relatable and more human is like he gets the most broken out of any superhero, right, like you know, bane literally breaks his back right, and he has to have another person step in for batman, right, like for months, yeah, and so like he goes through these things, and so I'd say about the plot armor on a, on a dc universe scale, I think there's a lot of like luck and you have to be creative about your writing. About batman has to be at the right place at the right time, to not get like gamma rate or, you know, dark sided at the first moments, right. So I do think there's a little bit of protection when he's fighting like cosmic beings, right, that are a little out of his scope. But then I think if you're getting ground level Gotham stories, like he's getting surprised all the time Like a newer, newer series or villain entry, that I think is great.

Taylor: 44:18

It's like the court of owls yeah and that's one where like, just like this kind of new villain entity kind of comes out of nowhere, right, and he gets trapped in this like labyrinth that they create for him and like there was no prep time for that, right, yeah, so I think on a gotham level, like they love to just like throw surprises at him, but I I would see, you know, if he's in some of those like justice league stories and stuff, like either he has to shelter himself and I think they do poke fun at it too like even like the justice league films live, some of the more recent ones like there's certain parts he just like can't participate in or he's just dodging, you know for little parts of it. So there's a little bit there, but I think so yeah, not invincible, but he's got skills well, it's just funny to me, because to all the haters out there it's like okay.

James: 45:03

Well, if we read a batman comic that doesn't have the plot armor, it's like batman steps out and dies the end it's like well, that's not entertaining. So I mean, obviously there's got to be a little bit to keep the character for his series. But one of my favorites, oh gosh, and I can't remember. You might know what it is, but there's one where someone gets Batman's files on the Justice League. He has like contingency plans. If any of them get brainwashed or go evil.

Taylor: 45:33

I think they call it Doom. There's an animated one called Doom.

James: 45:35

Yeah, I think so, and so he's got plans to take out everybody, and you know everyone's like we can't trust you, batman, but at the same time it's like he's the only person that has not got super anything.

Taylor: 45:46

of course he's gotta be prepared for it and he never used it, right like he had it on file, but he hasn't taken it down yet it's one of my favorite series, favorite series.

James: 45:55

In one of the cartoons is there's a moment where Batman's in the Batcave and he's going through all these video feeds and he's seeing all the heroes that are like being taken out. They're not like dead, but they're being disabled or taken down. And all of a sudden he's like Alfred, call everyone to the Batcave, we're under attack. He's like we're under attack. Who's attacking us?

Taylor: 46:13

I am Me. We're under attack. Who's attacking us? I am Me.

James: 46:15

It's like me and you're like whoa, what's going on? And it turns out that, oh, spoiler. No, you have to watch that Right, but it's an intense one, and I don't know, I've always loved that about Batman and then I always thought, you know, batman, you see, is like this soul, like he's the solo vigilante.

Taylor: 46:37

But then, like this soul, like he's, the solo vigilante, but then, as you dive more into the comics, he there's the bat family right and there's a lot of them. Yeah, it's like five robin, six robin, you know, depending on how you count them.

James: 46:43

And I had no idea, and the five or six robins have turned into other heroes yeah, you've got like the red robin and you've got red hood nightwing nightwing, um, and so I don't know it's.

James: 46:58

It's become more and more entertaining to dive into the, the bat world, because I just always thought it was batman and this little boy in tights that run around and, uh, you start to get to know these characters and and it's pretty, it's pretty cool yeah, like if you just pick up one that's like a current ongoing series, you'd be surprised like who's, who's this?

Taylor: 47:16

and why are they helping batman, right, like he's, he's, he's got sidekicks did you watch any of the cw like green arrow verse yeah, the arrow verse. Yeah, yeah, I'd watched first four seasons of arrow and the first probably three, four seasons of flash. I'd uh, I watched the first season of supergirl, maybe season and a half, so I watched a handful.

James: 47:38

I didn't watch all of them, but yeah, flash was an interesting one because, uh, I did think it was good. But it's like, how many times can the hero just be someone faster, right? Because it was like the first time. It's like, oh no, he's so fast, what will I do? And then he beats him. And then the next, oh, he's even faster, what do I do? Right that just seemed to always be the thing I can't beat him um.

James: 47:57

But uh, I was thinking specifically about arrow, because he's another justice league member that doesn't have any superpowers that's true um, and so what is your take on the green arrow and how does he relate?

Taylor: 48:10

uh, paired up against batman, I guess I I haven't read a lot of green era, like, obviously I've watched the show and things.

Taylor: 48:17

Like I'd say there's maybe a reason he's not always in, you know, the the front starting lineup along with Batman, right, like I think I think he holds his own, like I'm not saying he's a weak Superhero or anything, but he kind of reminds me of a little bit of Hawkeye and the Avengers. Right, it's like I'm here to support I'll, I'll make a few good shots at the right moment, sort of thing, but like if you get the big scale ones. But really you know that self-made hero is kind of a little bit of a trope nowadays, right that I think Batman and Iron man kind of started that off of. Like I don't have a radioactive spider to bite me, but I can. I can hold my own because of either my training or my skillset or other things, right. So so I think he's definitely a worthy entry of that category. Right, I wouldn't. I wouldn't expect him to last along in a fight with Batman, but I mean he did take on racial ghoul a couple of times as well.

James: 49:10

So do you ever see a there's a comic book series DC. Did you ever see there's a comic book series DC versus?

Taylor: 49:16

vampires I think you've told me about it, but I haven't read it.

James: 49:18

Yes, that one's interesting because you do get a little Batman arrow fight.

Taylor: 49:21

Oh, that's fun.

James: 49:22

But basically the justice league has been infiltrated by vampires and Batman and green arrow I think the other one's a vampire for a short stint.

James: 49:31

And they're actually the what's cool about is they're the only two that aren't infected. That's funny. So like the story is kind of kicks off with the two of them trying to figure out what are we going to do, Cause you've got Superman, Wonder Woman, Green Lantern coming at them and trying to kill them. So it's it's pretty cool, but I know we don't have too much more time here, but I wanted to do a little activity with you.

Taylor: 49:54

Sure, if you're down for it Always.

James: 49:56

So I tested this with my wife and it worked. I think it's fun, so we're going to. Ai is a big thing now.

James: 50:01

So we're going to use AI. I think it would be fun to come up with some sort of hypothetical situation here. I'm going to type it into the chat GBT and say, hey, this is the scenario and then we both have to create our own team and see who comes out more successful according to chat. So we can do it one of two ways. There's an objective that just each of our teams has to do individually and we'll see who has a better chance of succeeding. Or we can do something where we're against each other and we're forming teams that are going to have to go against each other. Um, I don't know what, what, what do you think? Do you have any ideas? I didn't think through too much of what our, our story could be, cause I wanted to leave that open.

Taylor: 50:41

So we can, I mean you were telling me about the one you did with Claire and I think that was super interesting because, like you told me, your team, like your team totally should have won and he sent me some of the more like the explanations I Like. Okay, I guess Right, and so I think if you're just doing like a, a three V three, like brawl or whatever, like it's a little surface level, but I don't know if I have like a great ideas, your first one was really good.

James: 51:02

Yeah, so. So the one that I did with Claire was uh, you had to take the one ring to Mount doom and you got three and we didn't even say comic book characters, we just said three fictional characters to make up your team. And I had picked Captain America, the flash and Albus Dumbledore. And my thought process was Captain America could have the willpower to withstand the ring and the flash could obviously get around armies and probably help get them to Mount doom really quick. And then Albus Dumbledore is. Albus Dumbledore is just very wise and a wizard and could probably not only help with the armies of Sauron but, uh, help them, you know, navigate the challenges that they come up against. And Claire came up with a really interesting team. Hers was Tony Stark, jack Sparrow and Galadriel from Lord of the Rings. And when we punched it all in, what we do is we type the reasons we picked them too.

Taylor: 51:53

So that could influence it.

James: 51:54

Cause if you mentioned a really good point, and I'm not mentioning good points on my people. Even if I might've been the obvious choice, it could still pick you. Um, but uh, yeah, I typed up what she said and why, and then I put my guys in why. And then I said who has a better chance of winning? And it said Claire. And then I actually asked at the end I said if I had picked Gandalf instead of Albus Dumbledore, would that have made the difference? And it said yes, oh, interesting. It said Gandalf had enough knowledge of Middle-earth and Sauron and everything that it would have made the difference, but Albus Dumbledore did not, and so it was just kind of a funny thing. So I wanted to try something like that with you.

Taylor: 52:31

You could flip it on its head a little bit, because we're talking about, like, batman's prep time of like, what if we have to take down Batman? And like what are? You know what team is he most likely unable to prepare for?

James: 52:44

Here's what we do. How about chat? Gpt gives us a scenario, then Great, I'll just tell him what we're trying to do and have it propose the scenario, and then we'll type our answers in and we'll go from there.

Taylor: 52:53

Yeah.

James: 52:54

So so the is in and we'll go from there, yeah, so?

James: 52:55

So the scenario that we're going to do is going to be generated by chat gpt, and what I've typed in here says we're doing a what-if scenario right now me versus taylor.

James: 53:04

We want to come up with a team of three comic book villains each to try and take out batman. Can you give us the scenario that we have to prep for to take him out, and then we will let you know our teams and why we pick them, and then you can tell us who is more likely to succeed. So if I put that in, it's going to generate a scenario for us which, okay, taking down the dark knight, batman is hosting a secret gala at the wayne manor under the guise of bruce wayne. The event is a charity fundraiser for gotham's underprivileged youth, but in reality, batman is gathering Gotham's elite to uncover which among them has been aiding the League of Shadows. He has set up a series of covert traps, surveillance measures and countermeasures to ensure no villains get the upper hand. Your objective is to send a team of three comic book villains to infiltrate Wayne Manor neutralize Batman and retrieve.

Taylor: 54:36

Oh boy, even if we're in the Batcave, he's going to send PD down there.

James: 54:39

I guess According to what chat GPT said.

Taylor: 54:42

Okay, it's a possibility. It's not off the table.

James: 54:46

Yeah, I don't know if you already have some thoughts, but I'm going to start pondering what my team will look like and then we'll plug it in. So the best way to make this work right is you're gonna give me the three villains and then kind of your reasoning why yeah, and then I'll do the same.

James: 55:02

And then you know it, chat gpt doesn't limit just to what we say. So if you like miss something obvious, it's not gonna be like, oh, all of a sudden this person doesn't know that, but you can try and justify which it'll take into consideration okay, which is so yeah?

James: 55:17

you know, like when I did the one ring, I'd pick captain america because I thought he was a, like a pure character that could resist the temptations of the ring. So I specified that because I wanted it to know why I'd pick captain america. Yeah, and so it took that into consideration and uh, yeah anyway.

Taylor: 55:32

So I'm gonna think of my team okay, give you a second to think of your team. Yeah, yeah, yeah, you're good. Are we limiting?

James: 55:40

ourselves to DC villains or any villain I think any comic book villain.

Taylor: 55:42

Comic book villain.

James: 55:42

Okay, so you can branch out of Marvel and DC if you know.

Taylor: 55:45

That's true. That's true, or you know. Third parties.

James: 55:48

Yeah, okay, so jumping back in. Then here's James' team to infiltrate Wayne Manor. So I have Captain Cold. Oh, okay, he has experience as a thief. I think he can break in and avoid a lot of the traps that Batman has set. He has smarts when it comes to an operation like this, and then I also think that if he has to defend himself, he's got his cold ray gun stuff that's true, like it always caused a bad day for Batman.

James: 56:17

Yeah, yeah, yeah, for sure. Um, and then I put dr doom oh, getting high level. I was thinking about it and I was like, okay, I guess it depends on how you view dr doom, because I think there's some parts of him as a villain where he's a little on the beginner level right Ground level versus God level. Yeah, and he eventually becomes pretty much a God. But I was picturing him and maybe I should specify that. But I was not picturing him at the God level.

Taylor: 56:45

I was picturing him at the. We're just like in Fantastic Four realm right now Fantastic.

James: 56:49

Four realm. How should I I should probably specify that, though, because I don't want to how?

Taylor: 56:54

would you word that you? It's okay.

James: 56:55

If you overpower, it's you know we just talked about not going god level but um, because then my third one is kind of god level too. I feel like a little bit, but I put loki, okay, yeah, yeah, yeah I figured loki uh and he's not kind of god level, he's literally a god but uh, I pictured loki could use his illusions to cover their escape and oh, I like that get away like that. So that was kind of my picture, but Taylor's team. I don't know why don't you introduce your team, oh, sure, yeah.

Taylor: 57:22

So first one, I picked Scarecrow. So one of Batman's weaknesses is I mean, it's his strength, and his weakness is his fragile emotional state, and so I think if there's a way for Scarecrow to get some fear toxin into Wayne Manor, batman could be crippled or broken for long enough for this heist to take place.

James: 57:39

The psychologist in you, man, maybe you should have just put yourself on the team, maybe.

Taylor: 57:44

And, as I said, batman's quite vulnerable emotionally. Finding a way to immobilize or distract him psychologically could provide the perfect cover for our operation. Second one I chose Brainiac. He gets a little high level sometimes, but I was trying to think of, you know, who could match Wayne's tech prowess, right, and Brainiac is a living tech entity, kind of early AI if you will. And so I felt like if we're going to break into the Wayne vaults and things, brainiac would get us in there in a snap. Like if we're going to break into the Wayne vaults and things, brainiac would get us in there in a snap.

Taylor: 58:17

And then I was trying to flush it out with, like if it came to a physical confrontation with Batman and Robin, who who do I want to cover the physical part? And and I thought Ra's al Ghul, like in some, in some departments he trained Batman, he trains, you know, damian Wayne, right? So depending on which Robin we got, he knows their every move, sort of thing. So how do you prepare against the guy who prepared you? So I thought that would be a good physical encounter cover.

James: 58:45

Okay, well, let's see. So when I did this last time, it gave me a lot of details too, so we'll see what it says here. Okay, so it says, let's break it down step by step based on the challenges outlined in the scenario. James's team Captain Cold Strengths. He's a skilled thief with gadgets to bypass traps and secure entry Weaknesses. His expertise is more grounded and may struggle with advanced bat cave level tech.

Taylor: 59:10

I was thinking the same thing, chap GBT.

James: 59:12

Dr Doom strengths genius intellect and mastery of technology. Doom could handle hacking the Batcave and biometric security with ease. His combat skills and armor give him an edge if Batman confronts him. Weaknesses Doom's arrogance could lead to underestimating Batman's psychological tactics. Loki Strengths His illusions make him invaluable for deception and misdirection. Buying critical time to secure the drive or escape. Weaknesses Loki's chaotic nature might disrupt teamwork, especially with someone like Doom. See, I didn't even think about that. That's why I think it's kind of cool.

Taylor: 59:44

It brings this stuff up.

James: 59:46

So overall strengths of the team this team excels in infiltration and technical prowess. Loki's illusions provide a wild card that could throw Batman off balance. Weaknesses illusions provide a wild card that could throw batman off balance. Weaknesses the team may lack cohesion due to the strong egos of doom and loki. Additionally, their escape plan depends heavily on loki's trickery.

James: 1:00:04

Taylor's team. Scarecrow strengths directly targets batman's psych. Fear gas could incapacitate batman or at least create a moment of vulnerability. Weaknesses fear gas requires proximity or a strategic delivery method which could be countered if batman anticipates the attack. Brainiac strengths advanced ai intelligence and ability to overpower even the bat caves tech. He would likely dominate any technological or data related challenges. Weaknesses brainiacs methods may be overkill, attracting unnecessary attention, such as from Gotham PD or allies like Superman. Ra's al Ghul Strengths. Extensive experience fighting Batman, his combat skills, strategic mind and League of Shadows connections give him a unique edge. Weaknesses Batman is familiar with Ra's tactics, which might make him less effective in catching Batman off guard. Strengths this team is balanced with Brainiac's tech dominance, scarecrow's psychological edge and Ra's combat experience, providing a multifaceted approach. Weaknesses their operation may rely too heavily on Batman being emotionally compromised which could fail if Batman remains focused.

James: 1:01:14

Verdict Winner Taylor's team.

Taylor: 1:01:16

Oh man, you're 0 for 2.

James: 1:01:18

Yeah, I know. While James' team has a great mix of technical skills and deception, taylor's team edges out because of its more diverse approach Psychological warfare, tech, domination and combat prowess. Brainiac is the trump card capable of neutralizing the Batcave's advanced security systems almost effortlessly. If Scarecrow's fear gas succeeds, batman could be incapacitated, leaving Roz free to secure the drive or handle Robin if necessary. James's team would excel in infiltration and escape, but Taylor's team is better prepared to overcome Batman's ability to adapt and counterattack.

James: 1:01:50

There you go so there we go, that was fun, that was fun and you have bested me. So if we go, that was fun, that was fun and you, you have bested me. So if we ever have to break into the Wayne Manor, I'm just going to follow your lead.

Taylor: 1:01:59

Just borrow my team, just borrow your team, I'll have you review my strategy. Right, yeah, it'd be fun if DC ever did like a Marvel. What if like? That'd be a really fun episode, though, to watch like an infiltration.

James: 1:02:10

Um well, great, uh. That is probably going to end this segment of the nerd nexus. Uh, taylor, thanks for thanks for being here, thanks for coming and chatting with me and for goofing off and talking things nerdy uh with me, so uh. To conclude, though, I was going to ask um, where can people find you? I mean, we talked about fable, so it sounds like your podcast doesn't exist anymore.

Taylor: 1:02:41

No, I mean you can find it on Facebook if you're curious what we talked about, but I don't think like even the server's up anymore because, we're not going to pay for something we're not doing anymore.

James: 1:02:48

Fair enough.

Taylor: 1:02:49

Um, you know you can find me on Twitter. You know twitter, tiktok, instagram, but I don't, I don't like post things, I kind of just scroll other people's things. So the one place we're talking about that I actually am like posting and replying and, and you know, engaging with other people is more fable and I'm new to it. We'll see if it lasts, but fair enough, um, but really into. You know we've talked about sanderson, so that's kind of where I've been nerding out with some of fellow nerds recently.

James: 1:03:15

Okay, well, I'll put a link to your table and if anyone is interested in following Taylor and his reading adventures, follow my table and chat with me about books. But thanks, taylor, I appreciate you coming and I guess until next time everybody stay great, thank you.